[Done live via telephone.] 1

Well, I heard Don count down! I guess that means we’re on. I’d like to welcome you to another Saturday night on The Don and Wynn Show. My name is Wynn Free. Don Newsom is my co-host. Don, do you want to say hello?

Well, it’s a pleasure to be here today with you Wynn, it always is.

It is?


You were grumbling at me before. Tell the truth. Come on!

You mean I’m not allowed to grumble at you?

You can grumble. Well, Don, I’ve got a question for you.

OK, fire away! Is it the same one you asked me earlier?

No, we usually start off with an apology! So go ahead.

[Laughter] Ya, I know! Surprise, surprise! I have no apologies to make today.

I told everybody how you deleted your whole e-mail file.

I just about deleted everything. Luckily I got most of it back.

Just to tell those who are tuning in for the first time a little bit about how our show works. Don is the founder of Bloginservice. He’s also a partner in a big business enterprise, which he never likes me to tell people, but I told them. There you go.

We’ll talk later.


He stays home all day and dedicates himself to bringing information about the changing world to whomever he can reach. And a couple of months ago somebody introduced me to Don. At the time I had a book out called The Reincarnation of Edgar Cayce and I’ve been talking to these group souls on the other side through two girlfriends.

He said, “Wynn, you should come on the radio.” He told me what I would have to do is produce the show myself. So I sat in my little room, talked into a tape recorder for an hour and told the story, which is still posted somewhere on blogin. 2 Don said, “That’s far out! I want you to do a show every week.” And I said, “It’s kind of boring to sit in a room and talk to four walls.” At that point Don and I became friends and started talking to each other every day there for a while. Right?

That’s right.

We were having these very creative conversations and I said maybe we should record our conversations and put them on your Bloginservice. One day I secretly recorded one. In the middle of it I said, “Don, I’m recording this. This is going to be our first Don and Wynn Show.

And here we are. We’ve been doing this for about two months, having guests. My motto for the show is “Drive Time Radio That is Out of This World.” I think that accurately describes it.

It sure does.

We’re bringing on a very select group of people who, I would say, have the criterion of having some understanding of this shift that’s going on in the world. And Don and I feel that they are credible and have something of value to offer people.

Most of the people that are tuning in and listening know there’s something going on in the world. Some of you know what it is. Some of you wonder. Some of you are exploring different options and surfing the internet trying to find out. We hope to give you an idea of what that is on the Don and Wynn show.

Today, we have a very, very special guest that’s going to be on in just a few minutes and her name is Carla Rueckert. For those of you that have read my book, The Reincarnation of Edgar Cayce, Carla Rueckert and her [L/L Research group’s] channelings are referred to in a great part of the book because the case was made that there is this group soul that has identified itself by the name of Ra, that we could call a major oversoul for our planet; a guiding system on the other side that’s been working with humankind’s evolution for millenniums. That group soul has been speaking through Carla. She has a website called www.llresearch.org. She’s dedicated her life to this work of bringing the message of this group forward.

My book makes the case that the same group soul was who was talking through Edgar Cayce as well as David Wilcock, the current, alleged reincarnation of Cayce. So, Don, what would you like to say? Your mother might be listening and she’s going to say I’m hogging again. So go ahead.

Well, you know, The Law of One series is information that Carla brought to humanity. I’ve been trying to get as many people as I can to read it, as you know. I put prominent links with little odd graphics so that it stands out so that people really focus on it. That material is so profound and life changing for those people who are truly seekers or beginning to seek answers to [questions like] who they are, what it all means. what is God and how do we fit into that.

This Law of One series that was brought out by Carla actually puts that together in a very wonderful way. It explains so many of the answers that people been seeking for lifetimes. It’s a really in-depth volume. When I read it I just read it voraciously. When people read it and get into it, they start to tune in.

And it does change you. There have been so many people throughout the world that have experienced profound changes because of that material! It would be innumerable to count them. We’re just so honored to have Carla Rueckert on with us tonight! To be able to present that sort of powerful information has been quite a task for her, I’ll bet! It’s just amazing to have her on don’t you think, Wynn?

Of course it is. I was nervous all day.

Before we bring Carla on, I wanted to give a couple of acknowledgements. There are a couple of people out there who broadcast this through their e-mail list and I want to acknowledge those people. They are both doing, and there are a lot of people doing, special things. These are two people that I have tracked for awhile and I know their intent. One of them is Will Blue Otter who has a website called www.prophecykeepers.com. Maybe he’s a native American himself. He interviews people with different prophetic information. He’s very dedicated to helping the world. His website is www.prophecykeepers.com. When you not listening to The Don and Wynn show and BBS radio, check out prophecykeepers.

And the other person is Jody Boyne. I looked through his website today and the URL is www2.hawaii.edu/~boyne. Jody Boyne has a website for “wanderers” and we’re going to be talking about wanderers in the next period of time. Who are wanderers? Probably most of the people listening tonight are what Ra calls “Wanderers.” They are beings from other densities, higher densities, that volunteered to take incarnations on our planet and then got all screwed up for many lifetimes. This is the lifetime [in which] we’re all suppose to get unscrewed up and make our divine connection. So Jody Boyne has a website for wanderers.

I might have that information on Proving the Spiritual page. 3 If people go to our link, Proving the Spiritual, they are going to get a whole bunch of links on wanderers.

If anyone wants to look up Jody Boyne, they can do a Google search and put in Boyne Wanderer and he comes up at the top of the list. It’s easy to find. One of the things Jody does as a great service is, he has an e-mail list. He sends people updates almost daily on what’s going on in the world. It’s very addictive to get on his list. Its very good information. If you find his website, get on his e-mail list. Maybe we’ll put up a link on blogin so people can get on his e-mail list because he has great information.

He has been totally influenced by Carla Rueckert. I’m sure he’s listening now, as well as Blue Otter. So we’ll say, “Hello,” to both of them.

Listen, who are we supposed to have on tonight? Do you remember? Was it Wayne Dyer? Marianne Williams? Oh, Carla Rueckert! Carla listens to all our corny stuff. So Carla?

Yes, Wynn?

Say hello to everybody.

Hello, to everybody! Don and Wynn, it’s a joy to listen to every corny word and I hope that I may offer some corn of my own. Popped, of course, with a little butter and some salt. And hello to Jody. I have not met Mr. Otter to ask him why he’s blue! However Jody is an old buddy of mine who has a link on our site, www.llresearch.org, for a long time. His place is called the ET Phone Home page. You can write in to Jody and tell him those weird stories that nobody wants to hear, not the police, not the UFO centers who are supposed to be gathering information on all of that. Jody will take it, as will we, actually, at www.llresearch.org. By all means write to one of us so at least you’ve got it off of your chest and you can go on with your process.

Hello to everybody! It’s just a joy to be here. Please don’t feel too honored because I’m a total bozo and a heavily flawed human being. I have been very engaged and very passionate about sharing whatever I do know with whomever wants to ask me about it, having to do with waking up and smelling the coffee and really becoming aware of the situation.

Believe it or not, I’ve been involved with this solidly since 1962. The interesting thing about that whole experience of the last a little over 40 years now is more and more, as time has gone on, I’ve noticed the similarities the sameness really, of the fear-based information that you keep getting. “Oh, my gosh, this is the worst time of all. Things are going to happen! Things are going to fall apart.” This creates more and more fear.

When you hear these fear-based channels, I just want to encourage everybody to take a deep breath and release all fear. Because this is an exciting time to be alive and there is no down side to it. We knew early on in life that at some point we were going to die. The fear based information is always some aspect of this: “You are going to die and you may be doing it later this year.”

In ’62 the predictions were for ’65-’70. By 1970 the predictions were for ’75-‘80. It was always comfortably a little bit ahead so it hadn’t happened yet. Now here we are, saying, Time to wake up.“ The Mayans have talked about 2012 [as the end times]. [It is] time to release all fear.

Now or never, I guess.

But it is time to get this job done. It is time to make some simple choices. Wynn, do you want to talk about that choice?

This is not my interview. This is your interview. I just want to say that we are all going to die, so if you’re afraid of dying you may as well start now since it’s inevitable.

What has become so apparent is that there is no reason to be afraid of dying because we go on. It’s like, you know I can say that and people can hear that mentally but one of the side effects of reading this kind of material and hearing the counseling of a group soul (whose members have experienced dying probably millions of times) [is that you can hear that] the entities in that group are still here and telling us how it works.

It proves that death is not real. No matter how many times you read it, how often do you get a chance? People say, “If the dead would come back and talk to me, then I would know.” Essentially, this is the dead, so to speak. God knows how many life times they died [in order] to evolve to be a group soul.

Now they are kind of watching over our planet. They are assisting it in this evolutionary process. You have been a mouthpiece for that Group. Is everything I said correct, as far as, you’re concerned?

You can get into details and pick apart any one of several statements which you made. But I think in general you’re on a really good track. I could talk, Wynn, if you want to, about what the difference is between one kind of guidance system and another. Or even the differences between the various parts of the Confederation of Planets in the Service of the Infinite Creator that I channel. That might be information that would be of some use.

I would LOVE to hear about that.

All right.

Before we go into the meat of this I always think it good to lay a foundation on how it all started. Because somebody that channels, and channels these immensely high sources is kind of a real anomaly to a regular person and they wonder, how can that happen? Why them? All these types of questions.

I will be glad to talk about how it all began.

Share a little bit about that and then we will go into more.

I’d be glad to. And really that’s where it starts, if you’re talking about the different kinds of channeling. Because it’s all personal experience with me. Unless you want to mix sources and become quite confused in your studies, there’s really no clear way to study channeling, because of the fact that channeling is a made-up word trying to describe something that people observe happening.

I can tell you what happened to me. When I was in college I was already a really kind of odd person, in that I was a mystic. I had been a mystic all my life. Jesus as a being was part of my magic kingdom, that place that a lot of gifted or odd children report going into where you know they have special friends and maybe they have a pet that talks to them or they can talk to the trees. I had all of that but I also had Jesus.

So I came from a situation where I was so mystical that the chief things in my childhood were perhaps different than what people are interested in with their childhoods. I was a musician, a mystic, a philosopher. I was always trying to go deeper. At a certain point in my life I became aware that my Episcopalian Church, into which I had been born and loved and had worked within its boundaries all my life, was just not enough.

I had fought that part of me that was unable to accept dogma. I had gone to my Bishop and said, “I’m afraid I’m going to have to leave the Church.” And he said, “I don’t think so and let’s talk about that.” I explained that I couldn’t buy the Virgin Mary thing; that it just didn’t seem that I was a very good Christian. I loved Jesus. He was very real to me. And I told him why. I said, “I am having trouble saying the creed.” He said, “I have trouble with the Virgin Mary myself.” So I said, “How do you say the creed?” He said, “In faith and hope. One day, probably not in this lifetime, I’ll be more aware of the mystery; see more into it. For me now it’s enough to go through it as an article of faith.”

He shook his finger at me and said, “Don’t you leave the Christian Church! You’ll have no one to talk to about Jesus if you ever leave.”

So I hadn’t left the Church. I was not entirely happy with it because I could not find any opportunities for absolute silence in my practice and I really wanted to include silent meditation in my rule of life. So this fellow about whom Wynn was talking earlier, whose name was Professor Don Elkins and whom I always called the Elk, in later years after I had gotten to know the man, was an intimidating figure when I first met him, I being 19 and he being some 14 years older and very accomplished both as a researcher and teacher and as a pilot. He just had all kinds of things going for him. He was very brilliant.

He’d been working to explore the paranormal since the mid ‘50’s. He would get in his little plane and fly off to Chicago or Tennessee or where ever and he’d talk to people, anybody he could find that would talk to him. J. B. Rhine was a friend of his back in those years. He talked to a lot of the UFO contactees back in a more open day, before the ridicule lid came down. Orpheo Angelucci, believe it or not, Dan Fry, people that actually had experiences and were perfectly willing to talk to Don about them.

So he was developing this knowledge base he had what he called Detroit [Group] information. The “Detroit information” was brought through a group that was very interested in man, consciousness and understanding and I think if you Google on ‘man consciousness and understanding’ you’ll find some wonderful material. 4 Don became aware of this material long before the advent of the world wide web. He went up to Detroit and had a talk with Walt Rogers, who had created that information.

In that information was a discussion by allegedly extraterrestrial folks about how you can create an extraterrestrial type of channeling group without having to go through all the bother of a “close encounter of the third kind,” to use Hynek’s term. Don thought, “Now this is interesting! I think I’m going to go back to my engineering and physics students and see if I can find a dozen or so students that would like to do this experiment.”

The experiment consisted of silent meditations, which is what brought me into it.

So here we have 12 engineering students, one of whom was my boyfriend at the time, and me, a renegade from studies on the other side of the street [at the University of Louisville] in Louisville, Kentucky. The sciences are on one side of the street, as it happens, literally, and the liberal and fine arts are on the other.

I was studying mostly liberal and some fine arts but no science whatsoever. So here was this very anomalistic woman sitting with a professor and 12 physics students inviting the silence and also realizing that it was possible that we would be able to pick up information by following simple instructions.

Everybody except me in the group eventually began to channel. However, the scientific value of this experiment was blown because Walt Rogers visited Louisville, after people had been sitting in silent meditation and not channeling for 6 months. Walt Rogers came down and did some channeling [to our group] and said, “You know, you guys are right on the verge of [channeling] and you’re just so afraid that you’re going to channel wrong information that you’re not letting it come through. So how about getting it together to sort of lay your tail over the line and do this thing.”

Well, immediately, people began actually channeling but the scientific value was compromised because of the fact that we brought in Walt Rogers from Detroit and he did that channeling. It changed things. So it wasn’t a purely scientific experiment. Nothing could actually be proven.

At that point Don decided, as a scientist, that the only thing to do was to keep collecting material because when you have material that is of somewhat dubious value, the main advantage to such a data base is to make it as large as possible so you can begin creating some understanding just from the drift of things. And we are still doing that at L/L Research.

I did not channel for 12 years and when I began channeling it was because all the people from the original group had grown up, gotten jobs and moved on. I came back to town after spending a little bit of time in Canada working at the University of British Columbia as a librarian and discovered that Don was now looking to create a new channeling group. He did so out of the dregs of the old one, which was basically me.

In ’74 he asked me if I would try channeling along the lines of the way that everyone in the original ’62 group had learned channeling. So I said OK. I began channeling. It was a potpourri of many, many voices. Because of my naturally positive tuning I was getting positive information but it was all over the place. I began noticing, “Oh, gee, if you ask this type of question you get this kind of energy; if you ask that kind of question you get a different type of energy.”

If I remembered [to ask] people to ask questions about spiritual principles, then I could keep tuning very well, so that it felt like the original tuning. If someone started asking me about specific information; about doom; about the end of the world; about ascension and so forth, all these trigger topics that trigger fear in people, The tuning actually drifted. It is like you’re switching channels on a TV or radio station. The information that you are getting varies very slightly but the impact of the information varies greatly.

So I began being far more careful about tuning before a session and about trying to coach people into asking questions about spiritual principles rather than specific events and so forth. My channeling began to be steadier and have more of a stability to it which people appreciated. This was a good five years before The Law of One material was begun. This was all conscious channeling and it is also [the type of conscious] channeling that I do to this day.

Carla, I wanted to ask you all the people in the room that were channeling. Who were they channeling? Did the voices identify themselves?

Well, you know, we had a wide range of experiences with the people who were genuinely trying to channel what they were picking up. Some people channeled voices [whose names] you see from when I was learning to channel in ’74. If you go to our website you can see all of those [sessions] when Don was acting as the [senior] channel himself and teaching me. They were teaching, they were teaching me through [Don]. The Confederation entities were teaching me how to carry their contact.

Sometime you got people that were just shouting out numbers and letters. Sometimes you would get people that were shouting nonsense; total nonsense. Don’s own father was very keen on proving that he was hip and he was going to show his son that he was cool. He began channeling and we couldn’t get a single sentence that made any sense out of the man. He was genuinely trying but it was pretty much all over the map.

But the people that were sticking with the silent meditation and were taking the information that they already had and trying to live it, so that they were doing this every day, began pretty much channeling voices like Hatonn, Laitos, Latwii; names that come up in my own channeling.

How about discarnate entities? Were any discarnate, earthbound entities coming through?

I did get quite a few discarnate entities coming through. People would ask for them. People these days probably never heard of entities like Monka but at one time in the ‘50’s the Monka tapes were all over the place. People would say, “Can you find Monka? Can you find the source channeled by so and so?” They would give various names that I don’t even want to go into! Yeah, I didn’t know any better than to go around to see if I could fish up whoever people were asking for.

Some of those things were very interesting I think you [can] get on our site and do a site search on Yadda, for instance, a fascinating guy to channel. Totally a discarnate entity; an inner planes guide.

Wynn, that might be something that would be good to mention. One big division between types of channels is the inner-planes channels and outer-planes channels. I call my own Inner planes channel Holly. It’s [my name for] the Holy Spirit. I’m a Christian! I take this stuff literally. I ask for the Holy Spirit and I talk to Holly. We have conversations right out loud.

Anybody can do this but if you have faith to begin with it’s a lot faster process. If you want to get in touch with your guidance system, sit down with a piece of paper and a pen and you’ll start. Just write a question out, then write down the next thing you think. Write down your reaction to that. Then write down the next thing you get in your head. You can’t tell the difference between your thoughts and your guidance. You’re that close to your guidance. So you really have to internalize the process in order to realize that its actually going on.

Or you can just talk out loud.

Or you can put it on a tape recorder.

Or you can do it on a computer. But one way or another, it really helps to externalize some of this so that you realize you are talking to guidance.

The people around you personally, usually, end up having some type of channeling experience don’t they?

Well I try to avoid that. But there is something energizing about my presence. I try to encourage people not to channel. I think it’s something to encourage people to get in touch with their guidance but I encourage them to do this so that it is strictly within their own energy field.

That’s interesting, though, that you say you encourage people not to channel. Can you elaborate a little bit more on that?

Gladly. It’s a very crowded universe out there and I have watched people’s personalities be split apart under the influence of a very strong channel[ing source]. Some people are naturally gifted. Some people are a little dense [psychically]. There’s a wide range of how much in touch with that balance between intuition and intellect that you’ve got. People that are tuned already to be a little fey, to be a little mystical, may well start picking up very strong entities fairly quickly. And these are not fragments or delusions. These are entities just like you and me. They don’t happen to have third-density, consensus-reality physical bodies but they are entities. Not all of them are pleasant entities or entities that you want to talk to.

There are negative realms out there, aren’t there?

There’s a lot of mischievous energy out there. There’s a lot of negatively oriented energy out there. So I think, in terms of channeling, I encourage people not to take up channeling. I encourage them to get in touch with their own guidance. You can’t get hurt asking for your own guidance. It’s totally within you. It is closer than your breathing.

It’s a different matter to pick up an outer channel and that’s what I encourage people not to do. I used to teach channeling all the time until I watched three different people, at three different times, have to undergo therapy and in one case have to be placed in a mental hospital to get it back together. Really a lot of cobbling back together t needed to be done. The poor woman needed “resouling” completely and that isn’t an intended pun.

It’s a wonderful thing to realize how real guidance is but it’s a very sobering thing to watch mischievous or negatively oriented entities take apart a human’s personality shell. I don’t like to see that happen. And it is possible for it to happen if you do this type of thing without the guidance of an experienced channel and the strength of the group tuning.

One of the things I was very strong on when I was teaching channeling was trying to teach people how to tune. That’s based on your knowledge of who you are. The hardest part of learning to channel is getting in touch with who you are.

The only way you can challenge spirit is from who you are. You say “I am one who follows this principle.” I follow unconditional love. The one whom I see as that entity which to me best represents unconditional love is Jesus the Christ. Therefore I am going to challenge in the name of Jesus the Christ, for whom I would die and for whom I am living my life and trying to follow his ways, his truths, and his life.

So I will challenge in the name of Jesus the Christ and I will make people that I get in contact with say that Jesus is Lord. I won’t make them just say it once. I will make them say it three times. I am coming to them to make a contact with the consciousness of unconditional love and if they are the highest and best channel that I can carry in a conscious, stable manner, then we’ve got a deal. I let go of my personality and I give them the floor. And it is time for who knows what! But I trust that group tuning that has asked the question that has brought the circle of seeking together I trust the connection that I have made and I let that energy play itself out. Its a fairly crystallized situation.

WOW. I have a couple of questions. Let’s just say I was coming from a point of knowing nothing. You say inner and outer channels. And when you’re talking about inner channels I guess you’re talking about your own inner self, higher self or inner intuition.

That’s correct. Higher Self is a good way to put it. Now the material that those of Ra [offered] through [me] was in a completely different kind of channeling; in a trance channeling.

And would you recommend that? Because that’s something I hear a lot of people doing is deep trance channeling.

The difference is that in the trance channeling you don’t really have any more control. You can’t stop it. You’re out of your body and hanging out somewhere else while they use the entire system, the body system, the voice, everything. It was a far different experience for me certainly very wearying on me.

I was encouraged by the ones known as Ra, the group known as Ra, not to do that particular kind of channeling unless I had Don Elkins and Jim McCarty as my batteries. 5 When Don died in 1984 I made a determination that I was not going to even to look for The Law of One or the entities called Ra because they had told me not too.

I did get “Ra’s” for a while. There are at least three times that I can remember receiving, “OK, I’m Ra and you can channel me.” And I went OK. Can you say that Jesus is Lord? And there’s dead silence in the realm of whatever it is that you talk to when you get this sort of information which is very intuitional.

At any rate I never channeled the Ra group again. You can tune before you get such a contact but afterwards, after you’ve gone into trance, that’s the end of it. The energies are pretty much [set.] You really aren’t able to affect the channeling.

So in that way it was completely different. Probably [that] is the reason people love it so much! Because my chatty personality was out of the way. Now if you read The Ra Material 6 itself, as opposed to my conscious channeling, you are in the Land of Nod. You’re talking about very compressed, precise information being given in a very narrow-band way so that every word is carefully considered. There are a lot of similarities between the Ra material and German philosophy in the density of the material and the difficulty of the language itself.

[For instance], when the Ra [group] was faced with the idea of speaking about people, the word “person” was apparently too far out for them to work with. It just wasn’t specific enough. So what did they do? Just like a German philosopher, they made up a word. Instead of “person” they called people “mind/body/spirit complexes.”

When people read the Ra material for the first time there’s a load going into it. You have a learning curve just learning the terminology. We have glossaries on site and so forth and so does David Wilcock’s site at www.ascension2000.com. He has a study guide, in fact, that was prepared so people can start to penetrate The Law of One material. If you click on one site or another, you find The Law of One material is on a lot of sites and in many languages. If your first language isn’t English, look around. You might be surprised.

If you find that you’re fighting the information just because of the language, go to A Wonderer’s Handbook, which is something I wrote for people who were having trouble reading The Law of One. I basically did a book by taking the most frequently asked questions from people that wrote in on the web site, because that gave me an additional data base where I could go back and check the questions and see what people were asking over and over. There’s a lot of Law of One material quoted there. There’s also a lot of my conscious channeling quoted there and a lot of stories and comments from the people writing in to me. And there’s my own highly questionable prose as well. I think that you might check that out if you’re having trouble looking at the material.

Also you can just click on our site, go to the Library, click on Transcripts, click on the year, 2005, and see what we’ve done lately. Sometimes, very synchronistically, something that you’re thinking about is something that somebody who has paid for a session with me or has come to a public Sunday session, has asked about and you can just go in there and go, “Wow, here it is. Here’s something I can think about today on this subject.” And [you can] just totally get into it from that stand point. It’s a really nice moment when you run into a question to ask and, man, there it is! Somebody has already asked that question.

I have a question, Carla. When you first started having the Ra contact, obviously, I would think you would think, “Is this real?” How long did it take you of having that contact before you said, “Man, I have something really amazing coming through me.”

Immediately. By that time I had been channeling for quite a while. I no longer bothered to question the process. By that time I had already produced hundreds of thousands of words and that it was coming from me was amazing. I wouldn’t have thought that I had that many words in me.

Did you trust the source right away?

The first time the Ra came through I had gone through the entire challenging process. They answered the challenge just fine. I trusted the source. I knew that it was anomalistic [in] that I couldn’t remember anything about it. I couldn’t even remember going to sleep. I knew that something was different about it and at the same time I trusted the Elk and trusted Jim McCarty and both of them were totally knocked out by this information. I never saw Don Elkins happy except when he was talking to the Ra group. He was happy sitting there reading over the last session, creating questions for the next session. He was happy when he was talking to them. And when a session would be over and I would wake up, this was one happy man I was talking to! I knew if Elkins was impressed I would probably be impressed if I knew what the heck was going on.

Unfortunately, in the beginning Don, ever being the scientist, thought that if I knew anything about the information it might pollute the information. So he wouldn’t let me see it. So I went through this time where 23 sessions went by before they let me see the material. And during that time, of course, Jim and Don would say, “Does your mind-body-spirit complex have a distortion towards fullness/hunger?” which was a way of saying “Are you hungry?” But, you see, it was couched in the way the Law of One information looks at everything.

In terms of our density, which is the density of choice, [there is] the concept of everything coming into balance. Things are not in opposition but contain paradox, so that you don’t have two opposing circles, one called good and one called evil; one called hunger and the other satiation or fullness. You have two circles that intersect with a common part in the middle, which is fish-shaped, interestingly enough. [The fish] is an old Christian symbol that means ‘unconditional love’ and that’s what the Law of One material is all about: unconditional love.

How do you find it in yourself? How do you find it in the creation around you or in the people around you? How do you find indeed the Creator Itself to ask about this situation? That is the kind of question that The Law of One material is so good at helping you to cope with because of the fact that, using this basic viewpoint, they were so good at putting [this] into effect. Just [by] the way they phrased things, you were suddenly given the gift of a cosmology or structure for the universe in which various things like the amazing dynamics between the physical world and the metaphysical world were not given in an either/or basis. They were given in the sense of these two intersecting circles with commonality in their middle. The fish shape is called a Mandorla. And this Mandorla is a place of paradox where paradoxes are resolved, where paradoxes are at least found to have a commonality that allows you to go forward without eliminating [either] hunger or satiation, without eliminating good or evil but beginning to understand that these are the dynamics of a larger picture.

Well, they were looking at us outside of time, weren’t they?

I think that in the time/space or metaphysical world, as opposed to the physical world or the space/time continuum, time and space are circular. And all that is occurring to us in previous lifetimes, in lifetimes to come and in this lifetime, of course, is occurring in a circle. The harvest of learning from all our incarnations is moving towards the center of that circle which is our soul stream.

In actuality I have a feeling that our individual soul streams eventually move into group soul streams and then eventually move into the Creator. That’s a long story involving a lot of densities, not just this one or the one to come but a whole octave of densities, one through seven, with the next octave beginning with the next heartbeat of the Creator which is the eighth density, which moves into the first density of the next creation. You have this wonderful exploratory trip through all these different experiences.

The experience of first density [is one] of being the elements: earth, air, water, fire, rock, sky, wind; all of these elemental things.

You mean we started out as rocks?

We still have rock-ness within us buried very deeply in our frontal lobes which we access only occasionally. One thing that meditation is good for is putting you back in touch with some of your other-density experiences.

You know that old saying, Wynn, “You’re a rock.”

Speak for yourself, Don.


Maybe you’re the bell. Wasn’t there a rock and a bell for everybody in that poem? 7

Mostly talking about rock and roll, OK?

That will OK be for me too.

You were talking earlier about the Galactic Federation and you were going to explain that. And we got into the topic of how you got involved in the channeling. But there are so many people right now channeling all these different beings. Many now on the internet are most specifically familiar with the Hatton and various beings from the Galactic Federation. I could go on and list them but there are so many.

There ‘s really no need to. I think what people need to take away about channeled information, in general, is that they need to be listening to their own discrimination carefully. Probably 95% of the stuff out there is not for you. What you’re doing is, you’re exploring. And when something really rings your chimes, you know it because you’re resonating. You’re vibrating like a wind chime or like a bell. And you’re saying, “You know, it’s like I knew this already. But I forgotten it! And now here it is again. And I’m so grateful that I’ve run across it because I really want to focus on this.” You just get this feeling. It’s very subjective.

I think truth itself is very subjective. You need to realize that you are responsible for your metaphysical universe. You are the Creator. What you say, goes. If you start taking anybody, me or anybody else, and you start taking our channeling as being a source that has authority, you’ve given up something very precious. And you should not do that.

You’ve given away your power.

Absolutely! Don’t give away your power. Read it. If it says something to you and you want to use it for a while, use it. But if it doesn’t get past the lions at your gate, man, just drop it without a second thought and walk on. Because there’s something right around the corner! If you’re seeking there’s something waiting for you to find it. I don’t know if it’s going to be in anybody’s channeling. It might be in a road sign. It might be, say, your totem, a hawk or an otter or some being in nature that you run across in your Subaru on your way to the market. And you go, “Oh, I wonder why I saw a hawk today. What was I thinking then?” You start going into that and you’re getting guidance all the time. It doesn’t necessarily have to come just from a channel.

I love the way you put that. I can’t thank you enough for that because that’s something that people should remember. When you give your power to channeling, you’re giving up your own power and your own choice. So much out there right now is coming from those negative sources, at least sources that are mostly positive yet have that [negative bias.]

That’s right. If people don’t challenge and tune and if they themselves are not at a point in their life where they know themselves very well, their tuning during a contact could vary widely. Consequently, even if you trust somebody’s channeling and say, “I know that, that and that was so good,” don’t give into the desire to trust everything that’s from that channel. Even me! I try to be really responsible and do a 110% of a genuine job at clearing myself out and making myself transparent and letting the source come through just without any distortion that I can help. Still I might have a bad day! So please just take care. Guard your own discrimination; your own temple. Because that is where it’s really going on. You’re creating your own sacred space.

You were going to talk earlier about the Federation.

That’s why I was getting into the densities. Because we have Confederation entities which have come from the three densities immediately after our own. We have channeling from a location that is totally oriented to refining the lessons of love that we have chosen in third density. That’s fourth density. Fourth-density channeling is love-based. So we have fourth-density contacts like Hatonn.

But remember that my Hatonn is coming through my distortion and somebody else’s Hatonn is coming through an unknown amount of distortion. They may not seem at all like the same.

And they may not be the same. Because there’s nobody more clever at sounding like positive channels than a negatively oriented source that would like to take over a positive channel. And there’s a lot of it going on in the world of channeling, where somebody starts out very positive and becomes mixed in their vibration because of the way they are reacting to the questions asked or because the questioning is just, relentlessly fear-based.

There’s fifth-density channeling which is very wisdom-based.

Then there’s sixth-density channeling like that of the Ra group which is unity-based, balanced between love and wisdom.

And this doesn’t get into some of the other dynamics that make channeling interesting, like the dynamic between power and peacefulness.

Basically those are the three densities that make up the Confederation. Some have called it the Galactic Federation. Some have called it the Confederation of Planets in the Service of the Infinite Creator.

There are also groups, or at least one group that I know of, which has been popularly called the Orion Confederation, not necessarily suggesting that all the stars in Orion are filled with negatively oriented people, but you know how that goes! One bad apple and the whole barrel gets a bad name. And anyway it’s a pretty big barrel.

There are negatively oriented Confederations that are interested in the propaganda machine and creating a certain climate on planet Earth where the people’s choices are indeed taken away from them. They live in a constant state of fear and their only hope is to belong to the right group and to do all the right things and basically become completely swallowed up in following the dogma of whatever channeling source that you have gotten hold of.

I certainly don’t want to mention any groups or names but as you explore channeling you will find some of the negatively oriented channeling. Just look for how it makes you feel. If you start contracting, if you start having fear, if you start thinking, “Maybe I should take some response to this, like finding a safe place in case things fall apart,” realize that you have stumbled into a source that has a lot of fear-based orientation and is probably service-to-self oriented.

Do you want to follow that? Fine! It’s your choice. You can graduate service-to-self just as [you can graduate] service-to-others. But it’s the choice that you do have to make. Do you feel like becoming more and more light, radiant, involved in loving and feeling genuine compassion for other people and responding to that, in being engaged in it?

Or alternately would you like to collect power to yourself? Would you like other people to serve you? Do you think you know the best way for everybody? Basically, [do you want to] be given the job of telling people what to do? If so I would join the Army or realize that you are service-to-self oriented.

It’s pretty simple. This is the density of choice. And that’s the choice. Do you want to serve the Creator by loving them and really making the focus of your life to seem to go beyond yourself or do you want the world to come to you? Do you want to magnetize things to your way of thinking? If so then you’re involved in service to self. It’s a choice. You have to make the choice and then you have to run with it. Its the whole idea of getting ready for graduation.

One of the things that amazed me when I first started reading The Ra Material was the fact that there’s a predisposition in my mind, and probably a lot of other people’s, that says, “I want to be one of the good guys so I want to be of service to others. Service-to-self [polarized souls] are the bad guys.” But in fact The Ra Material says that, as far as the Creator is concerned, there’s no [difference in] value from one to the other. One can evolve on either path up through the densities.

They did say that the Creator had a bias towards service to others and made that path somewhat easier, in that as you start polarizing service-to-others you start to become aware of all the help that is around you and that you’re not alone. This in itself is a tremendously helpful thing.

Whereas on the path of service-to-self you get lonelier and lonelier because you, after all, know everything and you have to get everybody else to do what you want them to do. So it’s powerful but its lonely in a way that the service-to-others work will never be.

You can graduate along the path of service to self just as easily as you can graduate along the path of service to others once you’ve made that choice. The difference between the positive path and the negative path is that if you stay on the positive path you have the Creator’s bias of liking it better. And also you don’t have to switch paths in early sixth density, according to Confederation information. The service-to-self or negatively oriented path peters out early in sixth density because you can have pure love for yourself and pure wisdom, but you cannot blend wisdom and love without becoming aware that other people are you and you are other people and that all of you together are one unified system, one final energy system, one final bubble of being that is creating a field that is actually the creation.

So you’ve become aware at that point as a negative entity that, “Oh, darn, I’m going to have to switch polarities or I can’t go any further.” Fortunately by this time the negative entity is extremely powerful. When the entity really decides he wants to move ahead all he has to do is that classic “convert” thing, that eleventh-hour decision-making that caused the thief on the cross next to Jesus to say, “When you come into your glory, will you remember me?” And Jesus said, “Hey, before the day is over I will see you in paradise.”

It’s that everybody-in mentality. And you can’t get that without releasing the negative polarity. So I personally would never choose negative polarity because, looked at from a cosmological viewpoint, from the widest viewpoint of which I know, it’s a short-term affair. So why go through all the agony?

So really all these negative entities that are out there affecting us are in essence lower level entities.

[They are a] lower level than mid-sixth density. They certainly have their part to play. I would never encourage someone to make a choice that they wouldn’t necessarily want to make. If they are drawn to that picnic I say, go to it and never mind the ants. But I certainly wouldn’t explore negatively oriented material like Satanism or any of its fellows simply to become more and more familiar with the details.

What you really need to focus on is how you want to live and how you want to be. People have talked to me a lot, especially critics, about how naive I am. But actually I’ve dealt with quite a bit of energy from negatively oriented sources, beginning with my own shadow side, with which I’ve had to come face to face again and again in staying honest with my own work.

There is also the phenomenon called psychic greeting or psychic attack, where an entity of a negatively-oriented higher-density path decides that it would really like to put out your lights because you maybe are a little bit too effective in waking people up and making them scratch their heads and say, “Gee, maybe it’s the day I’d like to wake up!”

So I really think it’s pretty simple. It’s not so necessary to know your enemy and to get into all the various do’s and don’ts, how’s and why’s of negatively polarized information. It’s out there. If you’re drawn to it and attracted to it, knock yourself out!

I’ve read through tons of negatively oriented information, in the 70’s, when I was trying to get hold of just what this phenomenon of channeling was about. I became aware that it was all such a con game that really I was going to treat it with a certain amount of humor! To me, the Emerald Tablets 8 were the best of the negative conspiracy information out there. If you’re looking for something to have a good time with and see a little bit more about how negative polarization works, check it out.

The Emerald Tablets of Thoth, right?

The Emerald Tablets have gone through a lot of different changes since I first ran across them in the 70’s. You can find the original story having to do with people finding information inside rocks out west, sort of like Stargate. 9 It was all [found] inside a mountain. They found all this information and then they just started reading off of the tablets. That’s why its called the Emerald Tablets, because they got so many tablets of information and they are passing this information on to you. It’s wonderfully done and it’s very stylish stuff and a lot of the conspiracy information out there is not very stylish. So if you want to look at, read and enjoy the trek through this kind of information, why not start with some that has some redeeming value to it?

I have a question. The fourth density is one of the heart’s compassion. Did we say that?

We did.

Now how can a negatively oriented service-to-self being exist in the fourth density?

Well, they love themselves with all their heart.

OK, I got you. So they love themselves.

They love themselves. And what is there not to love? We are all the Creator. We are all parts of the creative principle. I don’t know how to say that in a way that doesn’t get into mania except to say that we are very young Gods with a lot of distortion in our character.

There have been a lot of false leads that we’re following. We’ll find there to be a lot of red herrings. If that’s not a puzzle piece, put it down. Move on. You know, you pick up so much information and have to put down so many puzzle pieces on the way to this one piece! And you’re going, “Now, wait a minute. This piece resonates. I think I know where this goes.” You’re making your own projected truth puzzle here. How you make up the way you understand the universe is strictly going to be your creation. And you do have to be creative.

You are so balanced. I mean I just get that feeling that you’ve balanced yourself. It comes across in how you speak and what you said because you have the awareness of both sides. You’ve balanced that within you. I have no doubt you know exactly who you are. Its just a pleasure to be speaking with you. I love the way you’re wording things because it’s really all a journey. And you allude to that, that it’s the journey and we can do what we choose to do. We are little Gods in motion, basically, and whatever floats your boat, do it.

That’s right. Realize that what you judge remains judged in your world and what you forgive remains forgiven. To those to whom power is given the quest is for the right use of that power.

Responsibility! Correct.

I know you talk to a lot to people and counsel people. Do you ever find that you’re in the middle of counseling and talking, then suddenly they are blending with you and they start adding to the information? It’s kind of like the division between you and them [vanishes] and the person doesn’t even know it’s happening.

Even I don’t know it’s happening but I am told at the end of a lot of counseling sessions that it has happened. It’s a totally unconscious situation. I’m one of those weird psychics that has no idea. I don’t have a clue. Whether it’s channeling or counseling, that remains true. I really don’t know when I’ve hit something that’s so deep that the person might not have even asked it. It will come out in some phrase and they can’t even explain why it resonates but it pulls back from them things that have happened to them in the past. I have found that to be true a lot.

I would think so. Do you have the experience that we have this veil on this level so we can’t perceive things directly? Do you have this feeling that they are with you, like that they are paying attention to you? Like you’re eating breakfast and you have a presence with you?

I have a constant sense of presence. I really do. I invoke it and invite it even before I get up. Before I even get vertical, I pray to Holly because I don’t know what the day is going to bring. This is the now. This is my chance. The rest of everything fades away. This is the central point in my life. And I don’t want to miss information.

I know I’m going to make a lot of mistakes today, so I know to ask for help. And I ask for it. I don’t know why I need the help. I just know that the day is going to bring things. I really do need that basic tuning. So I try to start on it before I even get up.

Now, actually, could an average person—if there is such a thing, which there isn’t—a person that, say, doesn’t channel: could they just have this presence, their guide, with them? In fact, that’s probably easier than channeling, isn’t it?

It really is. Actually, I think the quickest way to become aware of just how incredible a resource you are, as a person, is to look at yourself in the mirror. And I’m not talking about looking at your face and going, “Look at that zit.” I’m talking about looking into the mirror, looking into your eyes, looking into the black part that the light is coming through, which takes the information turns it upside down and shoots it off in to the brain in little pixels. I’m talking about getting into the part [of the eye] where it is entering in to the body system. Look into that mirror, looking in to your eyes. Do it for no more than five minutes because it’s very powerful. See what happens.

All sorts of things happen to different people, depending on where they are. I’m not even going to say anything about what happens next. I’m just going to say you stop becoming aware of yourself as a personality shell and become aware of yourself as a real entity that can’t fool anybody and has no need to. You see the real entity emerging, living, and breathing, that entity that you can’t really get hold of no matter how hard you think. Just by being there, and looking at yourself being there, it cuts through a lot of detail and gets you into a situation where you can take a leap of faith a lot faster, after you’ve actually become aware of that person in the mirror that’s looking back at you.

Wow, Carla, wow! It’s amazing that you say that. It gave me goose-bumps when you said that.

Now, Don, when she said it to me I said, “If I look in the mirror I’m going to think I need a nose job.”


But, Wynn, it gives you character, just like my lack of a chin gives me character.

Obviously you must be psychic and you’re able to channel. Please don’t be modest on this question, but just how psychic are you? I mean do you see future events? Can you tell what people are thinking? Can you remote-view?

No, none of that stuff. I’ve avoided getting out of my body for decades because I’m just too sensitive for it. I’m not prepared to meet the entities I would meet if I were off gallivanting around. So I don’t make that choice for myself. I leave it to much sturdier individuals who are more geared towards it.

I would have said to you years ago that I wasn’t psychic at all. I remain completely unaware of it. However I think a lot of people are like this. They know what they know. And when something comes to me I really don’t question it but, usually, as I said before, what psychics say when they get something accurate is, they “got a hit.” When I get hits with my clients I don’t have a clue. I have absolutely no idea. I’m the last person to know. I’m just a naive and gullible being, very sincere and usually a little too earnest and not at all aware of my psychic tendencies. I don’t think I ever will be in this life. It didn’t seem to be necessary for me to know. It was just necessary for me to be open to believing in my hunches, believing in myself. And I really have done that for a long time. The more you do that the more you can do it. It’s a habit.

Obviously, when you channel you’re [deliberately] tuning in to a band, a frequency, and you’re picking up these various channeling sources and their information. But have you ever been walking down the road or sitting in the car or sitting at a computer when a voice just hits you right in the head?

No, I’m not psychic like that at all. I spend about half an hour tuning for a session. Even before I came on the show with you guys I spent the same half hour working to my best subjective tuning, asking for all the guidance that I can get, focusing my body’s elemental energies and so forth, just so I can do the best job that I possibly can and be as transparent to Spirit as I possibly can. Those are my goals, along with creating a really happy and loving conversation with you guys. That’s really important, I think, when people are listening to one of these shows, just to have the pleasure of listening to a conversation where nobody is trying to score on anybody or be right.

Don’s mother always gets on my case when I talk too much.

But she loves you.

Well, now she can get on my case.

Quite frankly I could go on talking for hours and so could Don but I think we’re kind of at a high point. I want you back again soon because we barely scratched the surface of The Ra Material, what’s happening, what’s going on in the world, all that stuff. Does that seem OK with you?

That is terrific to me. Just great. You can just take in so much information and you have got to breathe.

I do want to make a couple of comments. I would like to suggest to Don that we do a little section of some of your Q’uo channelings on Bloginservice.


You can pick the ones you think are best. And if you want, you can do [a channeling] especially for blogin’s checker-in.

I can do one of those over the phone. What I need for that is a group of three people. I see no reason why we couldn’t do it.

Should we do it live with Q’uo talking?

The only part of it that you should really have to do beforehand is to think about your question. The answer is implicit in the question. [I have seen that] over and over again. The way you phrase the question, the depth of your passion about the question, just how focused you are in asking the question, how clear you are about what you’re asking and at what level: all these things add into making for a great session.

Could we have listeners e-mail us some questions?

Yes, I think that’s the best of all. You’ve got the people that are listening to the show that create part of the group so it’s not just us three. Everybody’s involved.

I don’t want to open up the phone lines to questions. We want to monitor the questions.

You also need to check with me beforehand because I’ve been dealing with these questions for decades now, so I really know what phrasing is going to get the best answer. For instance if someone writes, “I’m really concerned about 2012 and I want to know about a safe place to go,” The [Q’uo group] would say, “Sorry, because this is something that infringes on your free will and we won’t talk about it.” If somebody says, “I’m so excited to be living in these times and I’m wondering if you could share any comments that you would find helpful about the Mayan calendar and 2012.” That receives a good answer. This was the question that E-zine, Planet Lightworker Magazine, asked me. 10

I sent that article out to lots and lots of people.

You did? I haven’t seen it yet. I’d really like to see that. Why don’t you send it to me too! They talked for quite a while about that because of the fact that there was no fear involved in the asking of the question. They were quite chatty on the subject of 2012. It has a lot to do with how you ask the question.

We’ll screen the questions.

We’ll talk about this more but yet, definitely screen the questions.

We’ll invite listeners to e-mail Don some questions. Then we’ll compile them and we will pick the ones we feel are most relevant and we will talk to Quo’ on the air. All right?

That sounds fine to me.

We can do that.

I have one more question. And this is kind of odd, because I normally don’t have any questions. Many people appear on BBS radio. They channel. And they are always asking me to put together questions. “Do you want to have questions or do you want to have sessions or do you want to know about this or want to know about that?” Even when they ask me to put together questions for this or that, I never do that. It’s not that I lack any curiosity. It’s just that—Carla, have you ever got to a point in your life that questions just [cease being relevant?] I don’t even know what I am saying.

I think what you’re saying is that there comes a point where you’ve been through the questions and you’ve gotten some answers. You go back into the mystery. You ask another question. You get the answer. The answer takes you back into the mystery. Eventually you think, “I’m content. I’m going to stay in the mystery.”

On the one hand, for somebody like Don, totally consumed with scientific, intellectual curiosity, questions were everything.


But his spiritual process was involved in the refinement of these questions. So it all depends I think there can be a real creative aspect to asking questions. I also totally agree with you. I almost never have a question unless it’s a practical question.


As I see it, as one becomes more and more in the here and now, it’s like, you ask the question, “What do I do next,” and it immediately comes to you. You’re operating in the hologram as it exists right now.

As long as you stay in the “now,” that works.

Wynn, the other day I was working with a very big question and the next thing I picked up [was a session which] I channeled in l99l. I was doing some editing. I’m trying to get a co-channeling volume that I did with Barbara Brodsky, who channels Aaron, for Deep Spring [Center for Meditation and Spiritual Inquiry]. 11 Barbara is a wonderful channel! The information that I needed, I channeled in l99l and I had forgotten all about! That’s how quick guidance is and how little connected with time. You ask the question and the guidance is there.

Before we sound off I want to just run down your different products. You have a book out called A Channeling Handbook. 12 Does it tell people how to channel?

No, it tells people who can channel how to make it better.

Then you have the Law of One series 13 which is five books, your original Ra channelings with Don Elkins [and Jim McCarty]. And then you do counseling for people.

If you go to www.llresearch.org there’s a page called “Carla’s Page.” 14

There are also loads, I would say hundreds of pages, of channelings in www.llresearch.org, right?

It’s over a thousand sessions now, going back to ’74 when I started learning how [to channel].

And those of you that need the input of higher sources to trigger your own wisdom have a free resource on www.llresearch.org. My experience of reading channelings like yours triggers my inner wisdom. It tells me things that I already know but which I don’t have at the front of my consciousness. And then I hear it and say, “Yes, that’s so!” Once I hear it, it feels like I’ve expanded to a bit higher dimension.

I think you have. You’re going up a spiral staircase. So, yes, you click on to something like that and, yes, you heard it before but on a different level.

Then my life changes. Things manifest in my life to match that jump I took inside myself and so I validated it because it has some physical evidence in my life that has changed. I remember that about 20 years ago, I was so screwed up that I needed so much input of information, because as soon as I was on my own I would fall off and get screwy. My life would fall apart.

But when I would read information or go to spiritual seminars where there was light and wisdom, it would pull me out of my hole, at least momentarily. Then I would drop back into it and have to crawl back out again. So if you’re one of those people that feels like you’re in a hole and can’t get out of it, you have a wonderful resource for free, for no money, to study Carla’s channelings on www.llresearch.org. There’s a year’s worth of reading.

[It is good to read the L/L Research transcripts] even it they’re not in a hole, Wynn. When I read Carla’s channeling it was profound. I soaked it up so fast it just sank in. It made just perfect sense. Like, “Yeah! This is correct!” I felt it. It felt a part of me and just sunk in like eating peanut butter.

Mmm, that sounds good!

I would like to make the point that, when you’re looking at channeling, you’re never looking at the channeling of one person, unless that person isn’t channeling but just sharing parts of their own unconscious process in a generous way.

You’re listening to the energy of the group that produced the channeling. The actual channel is a radio, a receiver, a transmitter and to some extent a transducer of the light and information that is coming through. We know that light is information and information is light, in terms of computers, because everything is brought in on the photons, on light itself. So whatever light or information you’re getting is from the tuning of the entire group. So it’s always to some extent distorted.

You’re never going to get straight information in words. Straighter information in words is available to the person that goes into the silence and listens to the “still, small voice.” Then you’re getting concepts. The job of a channel is taking those very dimensional, very living concepts and trying to nail them down to words in a row.

You’re always getting some distortion in whatever you’re getting. You’re never getting the straight poop from words. The straight poop is really in the silence. That is a marvelous concept and one that we can do. [It is] available to us all when we stop talking.

I think that what happens is when you read a channeling from a truly higher dimensional group source, if you have the sensitivity you start connecting with the energy of that group as you’re reading it.

I think you do.

So suddenly like a magical thing the words themselves trigger this change of energy in you. That’s one of the reasons. Sometimes you have to read these things over and over again before you get that experience. Some people will get it right off the bat. and they will know that BAM! Its like this! We didn’t go into talking about wanderers but there are many people listening who may be members of that same group soul that volunteered for a mission here on Earth and when they are here, the words are like taking them home. The energy goes back to where they started from.

That’s what we hear the most from people that log onto the site for one reason for another and just surf around. They feel, like, “I came home here.” And in a way you have, because you’ve run into the other 65 million souls or however many it was that incarnated here from elsewhere because they really felt the plight of earth, felt the sorrow of earth and realized there were a lot of people that wanted to wake up and you thought, “Maybe I can help here.”

Of course, most of it was having to awaken from the planetary sleep ourselves. It’s very important for wanderers to wake up before they can do their part, to breathe in and breathe out with an open heart and just start infecting the rest of the populace with this unconditional love deal.

That’s exactly what I meant by eating peanut butter.

That’s what we’re doing.

And we are giving the biggest part of our peanut butter sandwich to somebody else.

Don, did I tell you about our contest?

Do we have a contest?

We have a contest.

Who’s winning?

I’ll tell you what it is. I found a very sneaky thing to do.

Do we get to Win Free?


I have my CD of music which I recorded before I did any of this wacko stuff. I thought I was a song writer and a poet. In fact, next time, when Carla is on, we will tell you the story of how I had a broken heart and sent her all my broken-heart poems. She remembers that don’t you?

I do but I don’t remember anything I said that is remotely close.

You were compassionate.

Ah, the compassionate heart thing! That’s my strongest part.

I really needed the compassion then and it helped. I have a website up called Conversations With My Girlfriend with Girlfriend X and Girlfriend Y, we call them.

You and Jean-Claude Koven should get together because he has conversations with his dog.

He does? Well, I really do have two girlfriends, or I did.

Or did!


Now you probably have more than two.

I hate to call them girlfriends because they are much more than that.

I decided to call the website Conversations With My Girlfriends to make it so it wasn’t threatening, like it wasn’t this big deal. Everyone understands girlfriends. If a few people listening haven’t checked out the website, please do.

I don’t know if everyone understands their girlfriends!

Did I say that?

It was you expressing your female energy, Wynn!

We’ll correct that next time. Also my music tape is now available on CD Baby 15 and more of my songs are available from that CD, which is 11 songs, for download on the Don and Wynn Show page. 16 The first ten people that listen to the four songs and send in a review to Don get a free CD! How’s that? I’ll say it again. On the Don and Wynn Show page there are four songs. To win the contest, as soon as the show is over you have to go listen to my songs and send Don a review. We’re going to post the reviews even it you don’t like them! But send a review and send your address. We will automatically send you a free CD. That’s for ten people. Carla you listened to my CD right?

I did. You know I’ve been a fan of your for some time, Wynn. I remember listening to you sing for the first time in a motel in was it Mesquite, Nevada?


I love Laughlin!

We had many “loffs” [making a bad pun on Laughlin!] together. Wynn sold more of our books in the few hours that he took over our table, when we weren’t sitting at our table selling books, than we sold the whole week we were there.

I remember the delight I had in one particular song. It was called “Dig the Spaces.” I love that song. Is that one of the ones you have up, Don?


Go listen to that, folks.

Now if you’re not one of the first ten, you’ll just have to buy the CD.

He’s just as engaging in his singing as he is in his talking.

This is a very tricky thing I’m doing. I’m making people listen to my music and they’re going to write reviews and I’m going to send them free CD’s. Then we’ll put the reviews up on the page.

Our e-mails are up on that page. If you can’t find it because we have so much stuff happening all over Bloginservice, just go to www.TheDonandWynnshow.com and it will take you there.

Just keep in mind also to send us some questions. Remember, make them Carla’s criteria. 17 We will go through them and pick the best; then we will do a live channeling with Q’uo, maybe in three or four weeks. How does that sound, Carla?

We’ll have to set it up. I’m on vacation visiting my mother-in-law. I’ll have to get together with my day book because things get really crowded after Christmas. But as soon as we can figure a day, we’ll definitely do that.

There are people that graciously put us on their email list for tonight. We will put it up again for them if they would like to share that. This is a great opportunity for Jody Boyne’s list because those people are enamored of The Law of One. Think of your deepest questions and send them into us. The thing I love best is, we had a great time. I was nervous all day!

He kept asking me, “Are you nervous, are you nervous?” I said, “I am never nervous when I get to talk about The Law of One.” I probably should be. Wynn did it for me! Thanks a lot!

I processed you all day! Right. Is Jim McCarty in the background?

Would you like him to say hello?

Let me just say a little bit about Jim and Carla This is a whole other thing I would like to talk about. The two of them sit together and Q’uo jumps from one to the other. Carla channels for a period of time, then Jim channels and just picks up the same group energy.

Jim stopped doing that upon the advent of Jim’s Lawn Service because he was just so tired from working for a living full-time. The way money works changed in this society. We had a trust fund, the same money, but it was acting differently and we weren’t able to pay our bills. So Jim naturally did the thing we do here in third density: He went off to found Jim’s Lawn Service.

He works with all the devas and makes the land beautiful by mowing and gardening on it and landscaping and stuff. He comes home at the end of the day and at the end of the week and he’s just exhausted.

So after a little while of doing that he said, “Listen, can I be excused from this channeling thing? Because I never really feel like I’m tuned right. I need not to do this for my own integrity.” Its just them jumping from me to me now.

He filled his Quo’ta.


His channeling had a wonderful quality to it. What Wynn said was true. You can tell it’s the same source moving from channel to channel, if you’re doing this in a channeling circle. But every channel has a flavor of its own. Jim the cowboy was just the best in the world at channeling quick answers, so in a paragraph you got this jewel-like answer that was good to go.

I once asked him, “Jim, you’re such a cowboy! Is the only thing you say, yes, no and maybe?” And he said, “Yep.” Then he said, “Nope.” Then he said, “Well, maybe!”

For people that are skeptics, the idea of what happened to you, to have a source jump from one to the other between two people, most skeptical people would think, “She’s making this up,“or, “This can’t be real.” You walk around scratching your head all day saying, How did that happen?”

I think it is a good story to tell. Even though you’re not doing it now, its a good story because it’s a validation that there’s something transplanetary or some phenomenon that just couldn’t possibly…

Bigger than the both of us.

It’s not possible to make that up. Two people cannot possibly plot and make something up like that and have it come out so wise and clear, and so spontaneously.

It’s kind of like A Course in Miracles. That’s how I equate the power of The Law of One series, in fact, if I were to stress anything here during this particular session that we’re having, it’s that everybody should at least attempt to go to www.llresearch.org and get into the material. Because once you do, it will either sink into you and you’re going to get it or it’s going to work on you in one respect or you’ll just leave it alone. I don’t know but at least, like my mother always said, “Try your peas with your mashed potatoes! You’ll never know until you try them together. “

Also, if people are just interested and want to sneak in the back door instead of looking at the channelings, you could just follow the Camelot Journal. I write a daily journal about what’s going on at L/L Research. That’s on www.lawof1.org and click on “Camelot.”

Is www.bring4th.org working yet?

Bring Fourth hasn’t been re-launched yet. We got hacked down pretty well. Somebody really wanted us out of the way and fortunately the webmaster for www.lawof1.org, which holds several related sites, saved all of the information that he personally liked. He did not save everything but did move a lot of it over to www.lawof1.org to get back up my journal and the forums where people can actually talk. 18

I’d like to mention that there’s something that I’ve been doing for the past few weeks. I am doing a conference call every Monday and Tuesday and I’m talking about my own personal experiences. I’m talking about my book. It’s becoming like a little group-energy community of people all around the country. It is very uplifting energy, similar to the energy that we experience when we do these shows. Things get really loose and fun. There’s an energy that transmits out and we get e-mails back from people saying, “I got goose bumps,” and [telling] how things shifted for them.

So if you’re interested in checking into the conference call, e-mail me on blogin and I’ll send you the number for it.

And on that note, does anyone else have anything to say?

Carla, I have to tell you, I feel energy. I always have. I don’t know why. But you give off an incredibly balanced, serene. peaceful energy. And I’ve been sitting here [thinking that] there hasn’t been a show that I’ve been around or have heard of yet that has made me feel so balanced.

Isn’t that super! I’m so glad you had that reaction.

I do and it’s wonderful.

I’ve enjoyed it too. I can’t thank you enough.

I bet a lot of listeners are feeling balanced now. The rest of them are ready to move their bowels.

You’re such a beautiful person! I just thank you so much for being a part of this and being willing to come on our crazy show. Thank you.

Let’s close with the calling in of the light. I do this little calling in of the light. It’s like a group prayer for the people that are listening. When I finish I will give a space, if you want to add something or Don wants to add something.

Absolutely not! Just take it away.

Father-Mother-God, I’d like to ask for the presence of the light to surround and protect each person listening right now and that any negativity be taken to the higher realms of light and dispersed for the highest good of all concerned.

I would like you to see this energy passing through your body to the galactic center, through your feet into Mother Earth and healing our planet right at this moment. And while you’re sitting in this light energy, send it to those people you care about; those in need of healing.

And let’s all the group unite for a moment and send this energy to the grids of our planet, to all of humanity, for the lifting of consciousness as our planet is shifting from third density to fourth density.

I thank you all for being with us. I hope you’ll all tune in again. Don and I do this every Saturday. I really thank Carla for honoring us and Don for working day and night to make all of this possible and I wish you all a good night.

Good night and thank you, Wynn and thank you, Carla.

My pleasure, and sweet dreams to us all.

  1. This show airs on BBS Radio and can be found on www.bloginservice.com. Instructions for listening to this interview are found at www.bloginservice.com/bbc/index.shtml. This radio channel is an online radio station. 

  2. This is short for the web site, www.bloginservice.com. 

  3. That address is: http://www.bloginservice.com/proving_the_spiritual/index.shtml. 

  4. Carla: I tried that very thing and did not find this material. There used to be a web site for it, but the members of this group are now in their 80s and 90s if they are alive. Perhaps it has been allowed to lapse. The only trace I see on the net now is a junior branch of the Detroit Group who went out to Phoenix, AZ. There the material was corrupted, sources like Hatonn becoming “Commander Hatonn.” We have hard copies of the original material in the L/L Research library. It could be that we are the only remaining source of this excellent older UFO contactee material. 

  5. Carla: In Spiritualist terminology the people around a channel are called batteries. I have found that the group around me creates its own energy and that groups even out a group energy so that it is a smoother experience for the channel who is working with the group and the channeling source. 

  6. Carla: The Ra Material is another name for The Law of One, Book One. There are five books, in all, in that series. You can order these books on our site or from www.amazon.com. 

  7. Carla: The quotation I had in mind was from a sermon by John Donne. I suppose the “rock” was the “island”! In part it goes like this: “No man is an Island, entire of itself; every man is a piece of the Continent, a part of the main; if a clod be washed away by the sea, Europe is the less, as well as if a promontory were, as well as if a manor of thy friends or of thine own were; any man’s death diminishes me, because I am involved in Mankind; And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; It tolls for thee.” 

  8. Try this web site for more information about the Emerald Tablets: www.crystalinks.com/emerald.html. Or do a Google search using those key words for many more sites. 

  9. A TV science fiction program of which Carla is fond. 

  10. That address is www.planetlightworker.com

  11. This excellent Buddhist teaching center’s web site is www.deepspring.org

  12. Rueckert, Carla, A Channeling Handbook: Louisville, KY, L/L Research, 1987, ISBN # 0-945007-07-8. 

  13. Elkins, Rueckert and McCarty, The Law of One, Books I through V: ISBN numbers in series: 0-89865-260-X; 0-924608-09-9; 0-924608-08-0; 0-924608-10-2 and 0-924608 21-8. 

  14. Scroll down to the bottom of the home page of www.llresearch.org and you will see the little notation, “Carla’s Page.” Click on that link and you will discover all you need to know in order to make an appointment for a personal channeling session or a counseling session. 

  15. That address is www.cdbaby.com

  16. That address is www.bloginservice.com/bbc/the_don_and_wynn_show.shtml. 

  17. Wynn’s suggesting you ask questions about spiritual principles rather than specific information, and coming from the standpoint of investigating the truth rather than responding to fear. 

  18. bring4th forums are now up at www.bring4th.org. The rest of the site will be coming together in the months ahead. However, the forums up on www.lawof1.org are also still running. So there is a lot of good community on these two forum sites.