The question this evening concerns the nature of the mind/body/spirit complex; in particular, what is the specific nature of the spirit complex, how does that relate to what we know of as the soul, how can that knowledge help us in our learning about ourselves and in being able to be more of service?

(Carla channeling)

I am Q’uo, and I greet you in the love and in the light of the one infinite Creator. We are most blessed to be able to share this experience with you, and blessed even further that we may possibly be of service to you in your seeking, as our seeking at this time, as you would say, is all focused upon that which we learn by attempting to be of service to you. Thus, you are offering us a great gift by your questions, for this is our means of service and learning at this time. We too are upon a path to the infinite One, and we too are yet finite and unimpeccable. We are mistake makers, we are opinion givers; we are not and can never be completely accurate, for accuracy lies not in words. We can only offer you an estimation in your language of concepts which we have come to grasp. We thank you for this opportunity, but request that each use the discrimination of its own wisdom. That which is yours you shall recognize and remember as if you had heard it before, but only now remembered it. That which is not yours, leave; perhaps you will one day return, and it will then be your truth, but under no circumstances allow a puzzle of ours to become a stumbling block to you.

We begin now with your question upon the nature of the spirit complex and its relation to the entity you have called soul. We would begin by asking each to move in consciousness from the cerebral patterns of intellectual knowledge into the open heart and the wisdom that lies therein, for that wisdom is deeper, though conceptual and illogical rather than the ideation and ratiocination of the conscious mind, for much of the question which you ask is best answered by the wisdom of the heart rather than by strictly logical means.

As we depart now and then from logic in our attempts to express concepts not within your vocabulary, we ask you to suspend notice of our illogic, and await the sum, for only in sum can substance be seen. We thank you for allowing us the freedom of this process, for the question you have asked is less than easily answered in purely cerebral terms.

Each of you is an entity. Let this be basic and imprinted. Each of you is an unique consciousness. You are unique because of the choices that you have made. It is your choices which define you, your biases which express your nature. It is not in the clarity of your Creator-self that you exist in terms of the solution, but as an unique portion of infinite consciousness which has been mated with free will in order that you may go through the choosing process again and again, creating, enhancing and altering your biases and distortions. What could we offer to any, clear and lucid enough to be a perfect and empty instrument that could all be filled with the treasure of the infinite Creator? Nothing. We offer words to you because both we and you are learning, and yet do not know, but we are persistent, as are you. This free will moves firstly by chance, and in terms of your time/space continuum, this occurs for a long period. In the density which you now enjoy comes a very critical period in which the unique and distorted entity that you are must choose blindly, in the deep of midnight, how to follow the light.

Thusly, all discussion of the entity which is you as a purely metaphysical entity must in some way be wrapped in mystery, for it is not important to know the nature of the soul, or the true entity, during an incarnation. It is, in fact, baggage, for you are not here to practice discarnate skills. Each of you is here to be affected by an environment you know to be an illusion. Yet, why would you choose to be in an illusion which is so often challenging, unless that which is truly your self is aware of the great value of not knowing, and having to choose in faith, blindly?

Therefore, seat yourselves, and your knowledge of yourselves, firstly as one who respects the incarnation, one who values the illusion, for this illusion is a tremendous opportunity for you to know more and more clearly the nature of your self. Yet, this can never be a measurable or quantitative knowledge, for you, as what you would call a soul, are incalculable, inevitable, inestimable and eternal. Yet should we speak to you as imperishable beings of light? We think not, what good would that do you? You could not hear the words of light; you could not value concepts that have no words. We would become those who spoke in tongues, not your own; perhaps an exquisite experience, but not an information-filled one.


We are those of Q’uo. We greet you again in love and light. This instrument must sometimes pause to take liquid, and we apologize for this delay.

Now that we have thoroughly rattled your cages, and made you see the quiddity of your selves and your incarnation, and underscored this illusion’s value to you, we may be free to speak upon your question, for we feel that we have de-emphasized it appropriately.

As we said, you begin and end in mystery. However, within the illusion we may say some things about the relations between the mind, the body and the spirit. In terms of learning, within the illusion, the primary, or first learner of which most entities are aware is the mind complex. This is a portion of the self within the illusion. It is a type of computer which functions quite simply by answering “yes” or “no” to each stimulus which is received. Each entity answers “no” to the reception of perhaps 99% of all that is offered. The self chooses endlessly what it will perceive, and from those choices follow all the conscious choices. Thusly, it is firstly up to the mind to determine what it wishes to perceive, for the instrument known as the mind is programmed only for survival. And, just as the small animal which is one of your pets moves in relation to our energy in fear, so do each of you instinctually move either in fear or in the active fear called aggression against those things which are deemed a threat. Fear moves all entities until they are delivered by that leap of blind faith into an awareness of love. This is always the basic choice: to fear, or to love. Choices made in fear separate; choices made in love unite.

The mind, in and of itself, instinctually cannot move into the area of choice with any realization. It will, left to itself, continue any patterns that have been begun in the early days of the incarnation of that entity. Thusly, the unawakened life path is one of distraction, avoidance and aggression. By these means, the mind controls the environment, and considers itself safe. Fears, and lack of fear, move into the body complex, if there is no intervention either by dealing mentally with outside catalyst or invoking faith. Thusly, the body slowly sickens and dies, because the nature of the illusion is that of steady loss.

However, into this closed and incomplete consciousness moves the voice of that which may be called the spirit complex, although indeed the spirit complex itself is a gateway, or opening, or channel, which is able to transmit into the deep mind, through itself, higher principles and ideals that do not have to do with the illusion, but are, in fact, fixed. Like yourselves, certain principles are imperishable. Thusly, the simplest way, perhaps, to express the nature of the spirit complex is that used by the one known as Ra, the spirit complex as a shuttle, a means of taking the thread through woof and warp to create the tapestry of solidified beingness as experienced subjectively by each entity, each weaver, of the tapestry of an incarnation.

How can one access the spirit? One desires. All entities desire. This is the process of choosing. But what an entity desires is as various as the four winds until faith is invoked by will. We do not speak of beliefs, for beliefs limit, define and solidify into illusory distortions the imperishable truths of which they are the sons and daughters. There are many, many entities among those of your people making this choice at this time who are comfortable in not thinking, in unthinkingness. They wish the structure told to them that they may learn it by rote, and spend their time in devotion. Mistakenly, however, because of the nature of the mind complex, it is felt that one particular story about the Creator is the story about the Creator, and all others are not acceptable stories about the Creator. This is incorrect. However, each story appeals to those of a certain temperament. This entity has a temperament which finds the story of Jesus the Christ most helpful. Thus, it has become this entity’s way to objectify the shuttle of spirit, and to open within the heart and within the consciousness the gateway to Intelligent Infinity.

There are other stories, many and various. We ask not that the spiritual seeker choose any particular one. We do ask that the seeker choose, and, having chosen, never look back. It may take as long as you wish in the incarnation to make that choice, but when the choice is clear, it is very well to move upon that path with the greatest intensity and devotion possible, for what you wish to do as a unique consciousness, or soul, is to become more and more powerful in the metaphysical sense. Until you have done the work of spirit involved in discovering the imperishable part of yourself, until you have made and dedicated the choice of how to love the infinite Creator, the self, and all other entities, polarization cannot begin in any settled form which may deliver one more reliably into a denser light, and a more skillful use of that light in being and in manifestation, but most importantly in being.

The mind will endlessly inform one; the body endlessly informs one; and the spirit lies fallow. To request an end to incoming data seems a simple enough thing to do. This is the nature of meditation, the nature of contemplation, to remove oneself from the stage of manifestation that one may rest and seek its own self within. Learning is done in silence, especially silence potentiated with pain. Thusly, as this instrument has said this evening, pain is to be recognized and respected for the great ally to learning that it is.

You may deliver yourself into suffering if you wish, and say that you suffer in order to learn. This is a distortion which is subjectively true to many. You may also say that you maximize your opportunities to learn in order to learn. This is another way of saying precisely the same thing. Thusly, you may have pain, greeted like the sister or brother that it truly is. Welcome it with respect into your life, treat it as an honored guest, and be free of any suffering, or you may choose first one and then the other, as you desire.

The spirit, however, will only inform the intelligence when asked. Thusly, each entity has its time of the first and fundamental realization that is appropriate for its rhythm of beingness, and when that time comes, the heart is opened, the body quiet, and the shuttle is suddenly full of an effulgent light, an all-embracing love, and the entity, struck, is never the same again. This is a natural awakening, but it is all that is natural about awakening. Through the illusion is allowed that first impulse of spirit, but all choices after that first experience, which may be repeated from time to time, are the specific free choice of the entity. No learning comes without desire and persistence.

Now let us turn from consideration of the spirit complex to the consideration of the soul. The term mind/body/spirit complex is an approximation of description of the nature of the entity without distortion, that is, distorted only in the balanced manner that lies behind illusory distortions. The entity which you are, which you may call the soul, is first, last and always to be understood as consciousness itself, and as love.

Let us consider the phrase “I am, in love, with you.” Consciousness is “I am.” To define it beyond that is to distort it. The nature of this consciousness, this “I am,” is love, and the nature of all other entities in your density, and in any density, is love, manifesting through rotations of light. Thusly, all may say at all times, in any relationship whatsoever, “I am, in love, with you.” Let us pause and experience together the “I am” of us all.


I am Q’uo, and am again with this instrument. May we thank you for the privilege of enjoying the beauty and the harmony of your unified vibration. To be allowed the privilege of this experience is very humbling to us, and we thank you, in deep gratitude, for your beauty.

This entity that you are is subjectively experienced by yourself through illusion, while the integrity of your beingness is always preserved in mystery. You cannot analyze a mystery that has no answer. Thus, we move in a circle, coming again to our first point. To analyze an unique entity is to do the impossible, for both that which we call love, or Logos, or the Creator, which is a portion of you, and the portion of you that is unique, are mysteries, now and forever. It is a matter of allowing that mystery to be a mystery. That is most helpful within the incarnational experience. It is acceptable to be unknown to the self in a final way if one realizes that that is the situation and will be the situation until the allowing of consciousness becomes such that one no longer desires to know about consciousness, but only to be consciousness. At that point, which we have not yet reached, there is the returning to the infinite One, and the creation moves from creation to creation, as entities are sent out and then return, that manifestation may blaze in its appropriateness within the infinity of intelligence.

You are all things. The soul is the universe, and the universe, the soul. All that is within you is in fact outside you, and all that is outside you is in fact within you. All things can be known, and all things cannot be known. You are a living incarnation of paradox and mystery. Does this challenge you? We think not, for we think that each within this group has become aware that there are infinite concepts which cannot be expressed within your illusion.

Indeed, as we speak through this instrument this instrument’s main asset besides its purity is its craft, for we offer concepts to the conscious channel, which must needs then be given words. And how should we describe by words that which is the soul, except to say that the soul in manifestation is a bonding of love and free will, and process through the densities is choice, upon choice, upon choice, as free will is first paramount, and all other things but the individual will seen as threats, or potential threats, this moving on until the process of evolution of mind, body and spirit, brings each entity to the realization, hard won or won easily, depending upon the incarnation, that the will of the self, in its deepest sense, is the will of the one infinite Creator, and this will often does not make sense.

Consequently, the more realized the consciousness within the illusion, the more it may seem that one is a servant with a master; yet, you are the master as well as the servant. All is truly illusion. You experience this objectification of the master as you need solidity. Eventually you shall not need to be solid, or three dimensional, in the way that you now see dimensionality and solidity of form. You will be free of needing to solidify pain, pleasure, or any experience. And at that point, you are then free to open the heart, to do work in consciousness, and to share that work with others as the gift has been given to you.

What is the soul? The soul is you. The soul is the Creator and the created, an infinite unity, given objectification through the use of illusion. May each of you value both the self in its soul nature, its endlessness, its mystery and its paradox, and the incarnational drama which offers to you endless opportunity for learning the great lessons of compassion which may deliver you into a more realized observation of yourself.

What have you judged today? Each judgment has pulled you away from your soul. Unlike discrimination, which is a subjective matter of saying “This is mine, but this is not,” a judgment is a matter of “This is correct, and this is not.” To judge yourself for yourself is to do your work; to judge others for the self is to be a critic. And how shall the critic grasp the nature of the play if it is only an observer? Nay, you do not wish to be a critic; you do not wish, though you may think so, to be clever, and intelligent, and intellectual. You need simply to straighten up the household of your mind, and when it is tidy, to move into the heart. Through love, open the heart, so that without fear you may greet yourself.

Oh, beings of love, we greet each other in you, and you, in us. We are consciousness; we are soul; we are one. The rest is illusion. May you love each other, and in loving and serving each other, learn the lessons of divinity, for as you love, without judgment, without let or stint, so shall you learn your nature. We salute you, souls, all, our own selves, and we encourage you to respect, use and enjoy the opportunities that will so quickly flee before you. No one, after leaving the incarnation, is ever truly satisfied that it has chewed it all up and used it well. Therefore, may you burn with desire to do this deep work. May you learn your oddities and your gifts, and may you then maximize them through the opportunities that are given to you moment by moment by moment, remembering always that it is how you perceive the chaos about you that you begin.

We thank you for having given us this chance to speak upon this interesting subject, and would at this time ask if there are any questions that we may attempt to answer. Is there a question at this time? I am Q’uo.

I have a question. In the opening message you said that accuracy is not in words. Where is accuracy? Where does accuracy lie in understanding our relation to the infinite Creator and service to others?

I am Q’uo. My brother, within the bounds of your subjective experience at this time, accuracy lies in the open and loving heart.

May we speak further?

That is sufficient, thank you.

We thank you, my brother, and we extend our love to you. Is there another question at this time?

I greet you again in love and light. I was wondering, in the higher densities, is there also illusion?

I am Q’uo. There is indeed illusion in all densities before that of the density of foreverness and return. Each density has its proper and appropriate portion in your learning experience, and you shall, although you experience them all simultaneously, by the use of illusion, have the ability to experience each lesson in its own appropriate area, which you understand as space and time, but which in reality is a field without space and time.

May we answer you further, my brother?

Do you have a knowingness of a sense of what is forever and beyond? Can you show that at this time?

I am Q’uo. You wish to achieve an intellectual grasp of that which is not an intellectual concept. Therefore, let us pose to you that which is interesting to us, and that is that each of you is capable of asking questions that it cannot answer. From where comes this ability? It is not within the computer of your mind. Where, then, comes this hunger for that which obviously has no place in a relativistic creation? That is all that you can see. Why should you ask for more? Do you not see that the very thing that you are asking is in its very impulse its own answer? We would speak further if you do not see this. Do you see this, my brother?

You may elucidate more.

I am Q’uo, and we would be happy to do so. The concept of infinity is impossible. Consider this concept. You must go to the end of all finity, and then move onward. Yet, as you imagine moving onward, you are imagining a finite concept, which by definition has its own end. Consequently, the closest that the intellectual mind can come to a realization of infinity is a series of finities. This is not infinity. Each of you is forever, yet the realization of this foreverness, when complete, ends all need of any illusion whatsoever, and the individuality, which is more and more refined through the densities for many millions of your years in reckoning, increases the individuality of each, and it increases the unity of all, for each entity must make its own unique reckoning with unity, so that harmony and unity may become one, and as you are a chord, yet also you are one tone, and in that tone lies the concept and the actuality of imperishability, or eternity.

In fact, the nature of infinity is specifically the present moment realized for the first time in its many overtones, undertones, harmonics and depth. The resonant present moment is infinity, and is the home of the self. Now and always, we greet you in love and in light, because you are love, and you experience yourself in these as do we, through different arrangements of manifestations of light which express themselves as fields which solidify sufficiently to create manifestation, helpful and intelligible, through the apparatus used by those of a particular density for learning.

Thusly, we speak to you in words, our teacher speaks to us in concepts. Yet these are the illusions that we need, each at this subjectively perceived time, in order to carry on with our evolution. We believe that it is well, if one wishes, to increase the pace or degree of acceleration of one’s evolution in mind, body and spirit. We believe that in the third density, the foundation of the spiritual evolution is made.

May we answer you further, my brother?

Thank you.

Again, my brother, we thank you. We feel that you are somewhat overwhelmed with data, and we apologize, but the questions that you ask are very mindful, and when one is truly mindful, one rapidly runs out of good ways to express truth, for as words are in manifestation, just so, they lack truth, and become relative.

The special entity that you are will take these words and perceive them subjectively. We cannot do more than attempt to map out the topography of the concept which you seek. Thusly, as you speak with entities such as we, it is well to accept the re-examination of material from time to time for various levels of information which may be of interest at one particular time or another.

Is there another question at this time?

I would like to ask you a question. You mentioned earlier that it’s not the particular beliefs or tradition, religious tradition, that one follows, but it is important that he chooses one, and then sticks with it, with his whole heart,

Now, some traditions are—some people, some students prefer one tradition than other, and it seemed to me that after reading this Ra book, that you’re offering another tradition, at least as far as the concepts of this universe go, of the creation, the densities, and I was wondering, are they all correct? Is neither correct, or does it make a difference?

I am Q’uo, and we believe that we are aware of your questions. First of all, as you surmise, there is a paradox in that all traditions are correct, in all of their many confusing ways. That is to say, that the nature of the illusion is helpful, so that, in order to transcend experience, one must enter freely into experience. The way to realization of the nature of the soul and the nature of the Creator is through the illusion, not around it in any way. It is when moving through experiences that are appropriately valued and respected that one may begin to transcend them, and to achieve an immediate awareness of the presence of love, that is, the one infinite Creator.

Thusly, if you wish to move from shadow to light, it is well first to realize that the search shall be in shadow, and that you shall be in the shadow more and more, in pain more and more, as you continue to learn, to evolve and to grow. You are in pain because of the subjective nature of experience. It is painful to reprogram your computer, but as you go through especially traumatic experiences, or as you go through nontraumatic experiences in attentiveness, you begin to have the motivation to use each opportunity for learning amidst all the shadows.

May we elucidate further, my brother?


Will you direct us, please?


I am Q’uo. Let us rephrase that so that we may direct you to direct us. We wish to know the area of your confusion, as precisely as you may state it, that we go over ground no more than once. If we have been completely confusing, restate your question. We thank you.

[Inaudible] quite at a loss [inaudible] direction.

I am Q’uo, and we are one with you, my brother. Let us begin upon an intellectual state, and stay there for a brief period. An entity within the illusion is trapped and imprisoned until the entity realizes the transparency of the illusion. Each path, or way, to transcending relativity and achieving an experience of eternity, is just that, a means of ordering and discriminating amongst the choices of what to perceive and how to perceive it. The entity moves into the distortions of one particular path, and by thinking along that pathway expressed by an entity or entities, which may all be called that of Christed consciousness, the entity within the relativistic illusion, which you are experiencing, may become immediately aware of that which transcends the illusion in a final way, that is, the experience of the Creator as immediate.

When the experience of the one infinite Creator has been collected, reaped and gathered, blessed, thanked and honored, then a portion of the self is aware, in a way that it cannot express in words, of the nature of love, of the Creator, and of the self. Then, this immediate, ineffable experience, which is not learning, but the result of learning, may be broken, opened, as infinite as it is, and offered as love within the illusion, to the illusion itself, to those one meets within the illusion, and to the self.

What the paths are for is to deliver the relativistic self over to the worshipful and open and faithful heart. When that state has been achieved, even momentarily, by the seeking entity, the experience of unity with the infinite Creator is had and stored and remembered. It is at that point that all paths become one, just as all manifestations of Christed consciousness tell different stories, but in their essence are all one.

May we answer you further, my brother?

I am quite satisfied. Thank you Q’uo.

We thank you very much, my brother, especially for having the patience and honesty to direct us.

Is there another question at this time?

May I ask if the Vedic concept of the creation of this universe, and its controlling directors, known as demigods, can fit with the system of the Logos and the different densities and the entities within those densities that are described in the Ra material?

I am Q’uo. We find this instrument not to have the energy stored to respond in full to this query, and would suggest that this query be entered at the beginning of a working, in order that it may be given due consideration, for, indeed, this is a large subject.

May we ask for a final query at this time?

I have one question. If this is too lengthy, perhaps later we can ask at another time. Is it always necessary to ask spirit, the spirit complex, for directions, in order for the intelligence to receive it, or can the intelligence simply be receptive or open to what the spirit has to say, or the direction that needs to come from spirit?

I am Q’uo, and we shall attempt to answer this query. The questioner comes to the question and becomes the question. The spirit is not the kind of complex that is grasped within illusion. The spirit is, indeed, imperishable. It functions not as an information-giver, but as a water pipe. Information is delivered through the spirit complex into the conceptual portion of the mind, and in the depth of the mind it is allowed to take root, because of the desire of the student to know. And insofar as the entity desires and continues to desire with the most patient and full concern the answer to each present moment, so this opening of the shuttle of spirit may be encouraged.

It is also greatly encouraged through the loss of the ego in meditation, chanting, contemplation, creativity and other manner of losing the small and relative self in experiencing those echoes of imperishabilty which lie within each entity.

May we answer you further, my brother?

No, that is fine, thank you.

We thank you. I am known to you as Q’uo, and we hope that we have not only confused you, but also opened a few new thoughts to your consideration. May you be blessed with help and aid. May you allow the blessing of that help and that aid, which is always available if you may allow the help. It is often help in disguise, but if you acknowledge it, it will make itself known to you. That is the nature of spiritual evolution. You will evolve as quickly and as painlessly as you allow yourself. The secret is the attention. Pay attention, each moment. Extend the meditative self until it encompasses each moment, and then in each moment that which is yours will come to you, and will make itself known clearly. We speak of that which is beyond the normal evolutionary pattern, but we speak in a way which we hope draws you onward in hunger and thirst for that which cannot perish, that which you are.

We leave you in that which you are, in the love, the light, the peace and the joy, of the one infinite Creator. We are known to you as those of the principle of Q’uo. Adonai, my friends. Adonai.